INTRO:

Today, a friendship that goes back to the 1940’s….

When Jim Murphy was nine…. his Irish-American family moved to the south side of Tucson, Arizona.  They were one of many families who migrated west just after World War II. 

Carlos G. Vélez-Ibáñez and his Mexican-American family were already living there… 

Jim and Carlos sat down to remember life in their working class part of town…

Jim Murphy (JM) and Carlos G. Vélez-Ibáñez (CGV:)

JM: Do you remember the first time we met? 

CGV: I think it was on a bus. 

JM: It never came on time…

CGV: [laughs] 

JM: … and it was always breaking down. 

CGV: And it was green and yellow.

JM: Oh it was a hideous color. 

When we moved, uh, from Pennsylvania, I had never heard of Mexico or Mexican.

We lived in a government housing project. They were army barracks made into living units around a big dirt field.

CGV: Some of the Irish kids… thought we were Italian. [laughs] And so they called us wops. Right. So we used to ask each other, ‘¿Qué es esto de wops?’ You know, what is that? 

And we used to beat the heck out of each other. I used to get an awful lot of nonsense. I had to fight an anglo kid because he called me a Mexican so-and-so. 

But we were all Catholic, and that’s what really joined an awful lot of us together. We used to see each other on Sundays, so the difference between us in that setting was erased.

JM: Mmhm.

CGV: And then we started meeting each other’s brothers and sisters.

My sister, Lucy, began to be courted by young Brendan Flannery. I fell madly in love. With whom? Carol Anne McClain. I learned Irish Catholicism was more like Mexican Catholicism in their almost ferociousness of belief.

Many anglos in fact learned Spanish, and we also intermarried with each other. 

JM: I, I have grown to love Mexican food. Uh, the Mexican music. I think Mexican music is somewhat like Irish music, I can only stand so much of it. But after a while, it all sounds the same.

I feel that I could pick up the phone and call you and ask you for something if I needed it, and, and you’d be there.

CGV: You got it. Because of our experience in the south side, there’s a foundation that you and I have. Of understanding.

JM: Yeah, absolutely.

BACK ANNOUNCE:

Carlos and Jim will celebrate their 70th high school reunion next year.

Their conversation is archived at the Library of Congress. 

This season, NPR and StoryCorps invite you to interview a loved one as part of The Great Thanksgiving Listen. More info at thegreatlisten.org